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PrimerMovie.com
Official Site of the movie Primer
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silenophobe
Joined: 28 Feb 2006
Posts: 1
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 Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:12 pm Post subject: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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hey, i'm new.
i saw Primer for the first time two days ago. i watched it again last night, and read over this forum a lot in the last hour or two.
i'd like to thank you all for doing the hard work and figuring this movie out, without a few of the posts here (mostly the "everyone is too obbssesed with details" one and the "10-steps" one) i probably would have never figured this movie out. the funny thing, to me at least, is that i originally came to the forum to better understand how someone can shoot only 80 minutes of film for a movie that 77 minutes long! and make it with a six person crew for only $7,000! the story elements seemed second to those thoughts (and still sort of do). but, i'm glad i got a handle on what the hell is going on here.
i guess i'm still a bit fuzzy on the Grainger incident though...so, he finds out somehow about the machines, goes back sees an Abe, chases him, then sees a different Abe and Aaron (who were going to do the whole, punch Aaron's boss thing and not have it repeat due to the car alarm kids) and follows them, at which point they realize he is a double of himself, chase him, and he falls into a coma because he got out of the machine too early? is that about right?
and it is everyone's overall understanding that until Aaron tells Abe that he found the failsafe machine because of the storage manifests that the film is from Abe's linear prospective, right?
i guess that makes sense...
this movie is so amazing. |
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cheekymonkey
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
Posts: 43
Location: GA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 2:49 pm Post subject: Re: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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| silenophobe wrote: | | the funny thing, to me at least, is that i originally came to the forum to better understand how someone can shoot only 80 minutes of film for a movie that 77 minutes long! and make it with a six person crew for only $7,000! |
The best way to do that is to go to the search window and type in things like budget. Or you can search shane's entries.
| silenophobe wrote: | | i guess i'm still a bit fuzzy on the Grainger incident though...so, he finds out somehow about the machines, goes back sees an Abe, chases him, then sees a different Abe and Aaron (who were going to do the whole, punch Aaron's boss thing and not have it repeat due to the car alarm kids) and follows them, at which point they realize he is a double of himself, chase him, and he falls into a coma because he got out of the machine too early? is that about right? |
Shane himself says that there aren't enough clues in the movie about Grainger's involvement to solve the riddle. I myself contend that Grainger got involved when Abe called him. I mean, the guy dated his daughter, even if Abe gave the wrong name, Grainger might have recognized his voice. From there, Grainger followed them and it seems you're about right. But again, it is anyone's guess.
Except one small detail. When Grainger is comotose, the narrator goes on the tangent about how Grainger rouses from his coma until Abe gets close, like two rooms away close. I think, again, conjecture, that Abe can't get to close to Grainger because Grainger wound up in the box (and got out too soon) that Abe was in. If the two were in the same space at the same time, then the coma might be some sort of shock, like he's chronologically alleric to Abe. Again, total speculation and hyperbole.
| silenophobe wrote: | | and it is everyone's overall understanding that until Aaron tells Abe that he found the failsafe machine because of the storage manifests that the film is from Abe's linear prospective, right? |
X gets the square. The force is strong with this one. |
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tedb
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:21 pm Post subject: Re: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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| silenophobe wrote: |
i guess i'm still a bit fuzzy on the Grainger incident though...so, he finds out somehow about the machines, goes back sees an Abe, chases him, then sees a different Abe and Aaron (who were going to do the whole, punch Aaron's boss thing and not have it repeat due to the car alarm kids) and follows them, at which point they realize he is a double of himself, chase him, and he falls into a coma because he got out of the machine too early? is that about right?
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I originally thought that Granger got out of the box too soon. i think i even posted that here somewhere. I changed my mind. Now i think he is suffering from what the director is representing happens from a paradox...
When a paradox occors, people don't just dissapear. Instead they get "ripped" away from their reality and thrown into the current one. If you jump back, and stop yourself from jumping back, you've created a paradox. You don't just vanish, but it is also not harmless. I believe this is why Abe falls down when he is talking to Aaron on the park bench.
Now back to Granger... Aaron said his facial hair had 3 days worth of growth, but he was clean shaven earlier that day. This would lead me to believe Granger had taken 2 or maybe 3 trips back. And on his (let's say) 3rd time, he contacted Abe and Aaron (the chase scene) and created a paradox. Its a paradox because now they are aware that he finds out, and will now go out of thier ways to make sure he doesn't. Since this is his 3rd time back, the intensity of him getting "ripped" into this existence is multipled. "the problem was recursive".
I can confidently say that the director put in the Granger scene to show the havoc and the infinate unanswerable questions that occur when you realize your not on an original timeline. This scene shows we are not on an original timeline. And there are tons of Ganger questions on this forum. I'd say the director did it well. |
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pedro2112
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 456
Location: Midwest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 10:25 pm Post subject: Re: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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| tedb wrote: |
Now back to Granger... Aaron said his facial hair had 3 days worth of growth, but he was clean shaven earlier that day. This would lead me to believe Granger had taken 2 or maybe 3 trips back. And on his (let's say) 3rd time, he contacted Abe and Aaron (the chase scene) and created a paradox. Its a paradox because now they are aware that he finds out, and will now go out of thier ways to make sure he doesn't. Since this is his 3rd time back, the intensity of him getting "ripped" into this existence is multipled. "the problem was recursive".
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I don't think the strenght of the "recursiveness" is related to the frequency of box usage. It is related to the thought that you created the impossible.. a paradox. As soon as Abe got out of the car, Granger knew that his original (on the phone in his house) would never get into the box, therefore making him a permanent double. That, in my opinion, is what causes Granger's reaction. So then the question is "why"?. We know that the answer is unkowable as Shane stated he left no answer for that one. But I do have a theory, and I think it is just as plausable, if not more plausable than the "rachel" factor, and it doesn't involve multiple box usage by Granger....
I think something happened with the "platts" incident. The boys were on the way to the house to punch him out when they met up with the time traveling Granger. In the first iteration of the incident (which is not shown in the movie), something terrible happens.. perhaps platts thinks they are intruders and shoots Aaron and Abe and kills Aaron. somehow Abe tells Granger about it and he travels back in the failsafe... that's why he has three days growth, because he's been back for three days. Or, he doesn't find out about it from Abe until three days later, and then goes back in the box that was turned on at 5pm on the evening of the platts incident.
To me, this always seemed the most logical answer to a question that cannot be answered.
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hal9000
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 361
Location: Morgantown, WV, USA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 8:24 am Post subject: Re: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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| Quote: | | In the first iteration of the incident (which is not shown in the movie), something terrible happens.. perhaps platts thinks they are intruders and shoots Aaron and Abe and kills Aaron... To me, this always seemed the most logical answer to a question that cannot be answered. |
All caveats included, I think you're probably right. I think of how someone might answer the door at 2:00 a.m. with two guys on the porch. Platts might have been prepared for violence then.
Also I wonder... why did Aaron happen to see Grainger earlier in that day?
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Rob Y
Joined: 15 May 2005
Posts: 738
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| Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:12 am Post subject: Re: complete and utter film nerdiness at its finest |
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| hal9000 wrote: | | Also I wonder... why did Aaron happen to see Grainger earlier in that day? |
Uh oh. Another can of worms. |
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